“The future belongs to those who prepare for it today.” Malcolm X- Planned or not Planned

Transcript

Dan Fouts  0:13  

Hey everybody, welcome to the Teach Different podcast. We have a really cool episode planned here today with Caitlin Donnelly, who has a very interesting background, kind of at the intersection of education, workforce, and business. And I’m going to, as we always do on the on the show, we’re going to let her introduce herself when she weighs in on our quote of the day. And it’s going to be from Malcolm X and Steve. We have a couple of these Malcolm X quotes, I think, in the library. So this will be a really good one related to the future and preparation, and we’ll get to that in a moment to refresh people’s memory on the method here, just if you’re a first-time listener, we’re going to take a really profound quote from usually a famous person, and we’re going to break it down. We’re going to look at the claim of the quote. What does it mean, right?

Interpret it in your own words, and kind of give your own spin on it by bringing in your own personal stories, hopefully, that show your understanding of it and what it means to you based on your lived experience. And that’s really key. Using this method, as we’ve said in classrooms or with adults, that those personal narratives are what give conversations their life, so to speak. We’ll then move to the counterclaim after the claim, to get those critical thinking juices flowing, where we’ll disagree with it, and we’ll start thinking about the world through another lens that is different from the one that we were just embracing. And this has become a lost art in our society. Now we get so myopic with our opinions we have, we’ve lost our capacity to see the world through other people’s perspectives. So this builds on that critical thinking, appreciation for multiple perspectives, and then the other part of the method, as we know, are those questions that are organic, that come sometimes at the beginning, sometimes in the middle, sometimes at the end of the conversation. And a lot of times, we don’t have to answer them. We just have to state them to show that we’ve been listening and that we’ve we’re walking away with newfound insights and kind of a hopeful perplexity about the world. And there’s nothing wrong with that. That’s a great thing. So with that, let me do the quote from Malcolm X. I’ll say it twice, and then Katelyn, you can, you can jump in and give a little bit of your background and and what you think the quote means. Malcolm X, “The future belongs to those who prepare for it today. The future belongs to those who prepare for it today.”  Katelyn, welcome to the teach different podcast. It’s great to see ya.

Katelyn Donnelly  3:21  Claim

Thanks so much for having me. I delighted to be here and have this conversation with you guys. My background is I started my career in consulting, working with technology companies and financial services companies, and then worked with a British educationalist to do big education reform work, and from there, I went and worked at Pearson, which is a big education company in London. They do a lot of textbook testing curriculum, and I did help design their global efficacy strategy so how they measure learning outcomes across their suite of services. And then founded their corporate venture fund, where we invested in ed tech and education companies all over the world. I left, founded a company called delivery associates that worked with governments to drive big reform programs and measure outcomes. And then left a couple years ago and founded a firm called Avalanche VC, which invests in early-stage technology-driven companies that transform how people learn, earn, and own. And this quote is amazing for me, because I very much am actively investing in founders and people who really can see a future and are building today what they believe can become a disruptive change into the into the way people do things or operate or use certain tools. And so, you know, they’re not reactive to what comes they’re very proactive and having a vision of what they kind of believe needs to be. Needs to be done, and what can make the world a better place? And so I’m 100% on board, I think, with with Malcolm X.

Steve Fouts  5:09  

Question for you, have you always known that you’ve wanted to be an entrepreneur? You just rattled off, like all these incredible experiences, and I’m curious, as my take on the quote this idea of the future belonging to those who prepare for it, right? Did you when you were eight years old start preparing for a life of changing to different enterprises and not staying with one thing, how did you negotiate that, just on a personal level,

Katelyn Donnelly   5:48  

I always want, was very curious about the world, and really wanted to get out and do things like do it myself, like reading things in a book, or, you know, watching them on TV, just like wasn’t enough for me. And I think from a very young age, I kind of thought about, okay, what is it is out there in the world, and how can I go be, a part of it, be in the room where it happens, if you will. And so I just took every opportunity that came my way to be able to do that. So one of the first things that I did in high school is I joined the debate team. I go to debate camp in the summer at universities. We travel around, and I debate against other high school students. And you know, just doing those sort of things opens up your your eyes, helps you gain new experiences.

Steve Fouts  6:42  

So you saw a future where you wanted to see the world, and you incorporated something like debate into something that you’re going to do to learn how to interact and get an argument across. And I get it,

Katelyn Donnelly   6:56  

I think, it wasn’t like, as as, probably wasn’t as like, planned and thoughtful. And, you know, it’s easy to go back and be and make a story, but I probably was like, I just really enjoy doing this, like something intrinsically was like, This is what I want to do with my time and then it kind of like added up to a lot more.

Dan Fouts  7:15  

Yeah, I look at the quote, The future belongs to those who prepare for it today. I first thing that popped in my mind is my own story of becoming a teacher, where I realized at the beginning of my career the amount and intensity of preparation that was necessary when every single day you had five public speeches to give, and Katelyn on other episodes, I divulge my fear of public speaking as being one of the biggest things that held me back as a young person. And I tried to get over it in college, but I still had it when I first started my job. So I’m thinking of the preparation that I put into conquering that fear, trying to prepare my lessons the best I can. And it’s funny, you don’t even realize that you are setting the pathway for your future by doing all this preparation. It just feels like you’re not getting anywhere sometimes. But then, and I, and I’m sure we’ve all experienced this. You come to a point your professional career where you look back and you’re like, wow, I can really do this. And it’s that, it’s that preparation, that you can’t see the connection to your future immediately, but then it becomes your future success. So that’s how I would connect,

Steve Fouts  8:42  

And it helps if you like what you’re doing. Katelyn, as you pointed out, sometimes you may not be quote, unquote, planning out your future, but you’re doing things that intuitively feel like they’re developing you you’re getting challenged and you’re you’re learning and growing on some level.

Katelyn Donnelly  9:07  

Are you familiar with the concept of flow state? 

Steve Fouts  9:09  

Oh, yes, yeah.

Katelyn Donnelly  9:11  

 So it’s like, it’s like you’re in that flow state, right? Of peak psychological performance, between being challenged and succeeding, I guess, or feeling like you have progress. And if you can find something where you’re just constantly in that flow state as you move up in skill level, that’s a really, really effective way to learn and prepare.

Steve Fouts  9:34  

That’s a powerful concept. When you almost become unconsciously competent at something, and you’re doing things naturally, but there’s an order and a structure to it. The flow state is the most powerful a person can be. It’s a maximum state.

Katelyn Donnelly  9:53  

Yeah, for sure.

Dan Fouts  9:58  

I’m thinking now Olympics. The athletes in the Olympics, in this quote, The future belongs to those who prepare for it. I mean, these gymnasts, for instance, think of the preparation that goes into that the countless hours and so I think with and it’s kind of like the unconsciously competent gymnast. You don’t even realize you’re doing things at a high level, because it’s become, you know, part of your flow state. It’s just what, it’s what you do. I think sports, if I were to use this one in class, and I bet you, the kids would come up with with their sports preparation. Or, I mean, Katelyn, you mentioned debate team, right? Think of the preparation there.

Katelyn Donnelly  10:42  

I think sports is sports or debate are so are really good, because you can see the outcomes very clearly and pretty immediately, and everyone can see them.

Steve Fouts  10:57  

I’m thinking of Michael Jordan, one of his famous quotes. We have actually a quote from Michael Jordan in our library as well Katelyn, He’s got a really good one on teamwork, a good quote. But I’m thinking of him describing why it is that he practices so hard and is so religious about practicing, and I heard him respond once, and he said, It’s because when the game is on the line, I want to be able to revert back to what I’m used to, and there’s going to be so much going on, I have to be ready to change and adapt quickly and maybe take that last shot. And I want to know that I practice and got myself to this state so I don’t have to worry about it as much. It was an interesting take on it.

Katelyn Donnelly  11:55  

Yeah, it’s almost like it’s rote, you know? It’s like part of who he is. Now. It’s not just like something. He’s consciously having to think about

Dan Fouts  12:06  

Where some athletes, I guess, in high-pressure situations, they actually slow down as they do the opposite of becoming anxious. They slow the world down. Their breathing is more regular, yeah, 

Steve Fouts  12:22  Counterclaim

When I look at this quote, I see a big and a little application the future thinking of careers when you’re growing up, what am I going to do with my life? We came from a family of teachers Katelyn, so we always kind of had a default. That we teach. That’s what everyone does. That’s what we thought everyone did. But then I and I don’t know if we’re ready for a counterclaim here, but I also see this as something as simple as, let’s say you do have a speech to give, and you got to get up in front of some people, and you got five minutes. How do you prepare for that? And that’s where I start seeing a different way of looking at this. And I think that there is something called over-preparedness, where you actually create anxiety by trying to control the future a little bit too much. And my quick example for me is that when I do public speaking if I have a script that I’m supposed to follow. I am so nervous I developed this anxiety because I have this expectation for a future action. But when I’m like, drug up and they want me to say something and maybe my accountability metric is lower? Yeah, I relax in a way, and I don’t know if that is making sense, but sometimes I guess not preparing also helps to get into the flow state and be an effective person.

Katelyn Donnelly  14:16  

Well, I that makes sense to me, because you like, there’s the fear of being in front of people and speaking, and then there’s the fear of forgetting what you’re supposed to say. And so then you have two fears, actually, instead of one fear, when you feel like, oh, did I get everything? Did I do it in the right order? Like, I think that fear begins to even take over and compound.

Dan Fouts  14:41  

I like that example that you bring up Steve with public speaking. I’m also thinking of my students how they would process this. And I have so many students who over-prepare for things, and who who literally work themselves into anxiety and a frenzied worry that they’re not going to do well on an exam or some sort of performance they’re doing in class. So I can definitely feel that over-preparedness can be a detriment, which ends up ruining your future. And I think a lot of kids could connect with that too, with the anxiety and depression that that they’re having to deal with. Now, I know.

Katelyn Donnelly  15:26  

I probably spend as much time with kids as you, as you guys do, but do you see the sort of people mask the amount of work that goes into something? It’s like on social media, you only see the result, or you only you only see this like story that people are telling, and you’re not actually seeing the preparation, or even the special effects or all the other things that would give more real context to what people are seeing.

Dan Fouts  15:55  

I think definitely that that is a dynamic where the kids see the end product and they don’t see the work that goes behind it, and so naturally, then they come into the classroom, if we’re just talking about social media, engendering this in people, they come into the classroom not understanding and appreciating the hard work and preparation that go into things. Yeah, yeah. I’ve never thought about it in that particular way, though. Katelyn, that’s really interesting.

Katelyn Donnelly  16:25  

You’re like, your Kim Kardashian has like, a army of people, publicists, hair stylists, whatever that like, make her look the way she does, and probably a bunch of plastic surgeries and things like that, right? And you’re like, you don’t see that preparation. You just see, maybe you just see someone going to a party or whatever.

Steve Fouts  16:48  

That’s a great example a reality television show. Because what is it supposedly projecting? Yeah, random, spontaneous, not planned events, correct? And here we are thinking that that is what these really are. When the 20 producers in the background, it’s creating a optics that are not matched with reality, and that’s a really nuanced topic. I have to add in from the teacher’s perspective as well when you’re a nice person and you have a positive attitude to the world, people don’t realize how difficult it is To maintain that personality in this world and the preparations you have to go through to make sure that you’re not judging someone, you’re not overreacting to something someone said. You’re not spouting off at your first emotion, but you’re reflecting. These are preparations that you make. But what? What is the everyone see? Yeah, they see this nice person that they might think is weak, yeah, and it’s all skewed, yeah. I don’t know what to do about that, though. Katelyn, what? How do you get people to appreciate the preparation behind something? I don’t know an answer to that.

Katelyn Donnelly  18:23  

Well, maybe, maybe sports is one way, one way where it’s just so visible, like the people have, you know, are practicing, and you know what kind of like, what it takes is, is part of the process, versus, you know, your Hollywood is, you know, a mask or a story that people you know purposely don’t show the effort behind. And so maybe it’s just like it has to do with culture as well, and and you know who you surround yourself with, their values and whether they want to like, support their friends and family, and being a nice person and and doing the effort that it takes to be like an upstanding member, a contributing member of society.

Dan Fouts  19:06  

I got another angle on the counterclaim. I was thinking, my students are totally on my mind right now, since everything’s starting on Monday, how about an unexpected death in the family? You know, the future belongs to those who prepare for it today. Well, I would twist Malcolm X’s words and say no, the future belongs to people who are able to take an unexpected event and make something beautiful out of it, you know, whether it be the way they grieve or how they change and become a better person as a result of a personal tragedy. So in that sense, it’s not about preparation, it’s about reaction to things that you can’t plan for. I mean, death is kind of a heavy example of this. But you could bring this to a very banal situation. I can’t, can’t think of one right now. But why don’t know, you get a bad grade on an exam. You didn’t expect it. How are you going to react to it? You’re going to move forward. You’re going to are you going to give up?

Katelyn Donnelly   20:21  

Well, I guess there’s both preparation, probably in having that sort of perseverance, that attitude, to then make the reaction to something that’s very unexpected. Yeah,

Dan Fouts  20:34  

That’s a great point. How you react to it is dependent on your preparation beforehand as well. So now it’s mixing here.

Steve Fouts  20:43  

I was gonna suggest that, yeah, you actually are preparing when you’re putting yourself in a position where you can adapt quickly to something, there’s a preparation in that, a lot of reflection.

Katelyn Donnelly  21:01  

There’s like, this is maybe another quote. So I don’t know if we’re supposed to bring two quotes into this discussion, but like, one that I’ve heard a lot recently is, like, a tiger doesn’t change its stripes, which is sort of like the idea that you know if you see a pattern of behavior from someone, it’s like, very unrealistic that you’re gonna they’re going to then change their behavior. You know, whether that’s like, how they handle money, or like, whether they will are reliable to like, show up on time. It’s, it’s, you know, it’s like, sometimes we want to project that people can change or will change, but that through line is more likely than not to stay the same.

Steve Fouts  21:40  

So you’re preparing for this friend that you know has these tendencies, who just made another vague promise that they’re not going to follow through with, and you’re preparing yourself for it not to happen.

Katelyn Donnelly  21:56  

You’re I think about it a lot with you know, founders I invest in, is that because you kind of look at their track record, like someone’s track record of what they have accomplished. Sometimes people say, Oh, I’m a five-time founder. And you’re like, well, actually, is it good to be a five-time founder? Because Mark Zuckerberg is a one-time founder, you know, like, sometimes like, How many times have you started something, and then is it, like, just not totally, like, worked out, and then it’s like, why would you think that the sixth time that they’ve they’ve found something that’s going to, like, have a big outcome for investors? So sometimes it’s better to, like, take someone who’s maybe, like, accomplished big things, but not, you know, necessarily a company than betting on the like person who says they’ve done it quite a few times, but the outcomes have been maybe mediocre.

Steve Fouts  22:52  

That is a great example, and you just made me reflect on our lives immediately. Katelyn, we are this would be called, really, our third enterprise. Teach different we started a company back in 2000 and built some software for teachers, basically Dropbox, before its time. It was really, really good, and it’s still good, like we still have the wireframe with it, and there may be a time to bring it back in, but it was a learning experience. And then we formed a nonprofit in 2009 to learn that other industry, essentially, and that other culture, because we questioned whether or not we should be working, you know, in the nonprofit industry with our ideas, and we built some more software, some lesson plan sharing software for teachers, and so that still is in existence that organization called the Republic Foundation, and then teach different in 2017 where both of us are nearing the end of our careers as teachers. And I don’t know, Dan, you can speak to this if you want, but we feel that we finally found something that leverages like who we are as people. And you know, our knowledge of just, you know how, what’s it mean to form an organization? And, what goes into it? And don’t be wide-eyed and Bucha about this. You know, you have to learn from your failures, etc. So anyway, thanks for bringing that out. I’m now critiquing, you know, how we’re we’ve handled it,

Dan Fouts  24:40  

And I think, I think what you’re getting at is that what prepared us were those two experiences that were different, but when you think of them together, the nonprofit, the for-profit, that we’re now a kind of an interesting mix of both. We have values that live in both worlds, which, you know, sometimes when you’re unique, you got to just embrace your uniqueness. This is who you are. Don’t ever be someone you’re not. And that’s and that’s comes with age and maturity and so on. So, yeah, interesting. How you connected that? Steve!

Steve Fouts  25:20  

I was going to just mention one other thing with preparation. Sometimes, if you over-prepared, it may seem a little inauthentic, again, depending on the context. And I think that’s kind of what I was referring to earlier, with the spontaneous nature, sometimes that comes off a bit better.

Katelyn Donnelly  25:49  

Well, it’s interesting look, one of the reasons that I want to come on this podcast or do more speaking events is that is because every time I practice explain, like telling people who I am, what my story is, what I’m interested in, what I believe in. I use less filler words, I speak more compoundingly, or you find like the example that people really resonate with. And so I think it depends on the nature of practice, like if I was sitting here and like, writing out what I wanted to say and and getting in my own head, then I think I could come across as very inauthentic. But I think the more that I, you know, speak on panels or go on podcasts, I’m always like, not just practicing, but like refining to, like get to a clear way of understanding myself and like, what I believe in, what I want to do, and I so I find that sort of like push back in conversation to be very helpful.

Dan Fouts  26:50  

Yeah, that’s great. Yeah, you, you definitely present as very authentic. I would say no errors here, here’s who I am, here’s my background, here’s what I passionate about. And you can tell you’ve you have done this for audiences before, and hopefully, that’s also true of Steve and me. You know, it just, it takes, it takes a while,

Katelyn Donnelly  27:14  

But then you meet some people, and you can tell that it’s like a talking point, like they because they’re not really responding to a question. They’re, like, trying to always get back to, like, their talk track of whatever it is that it that they’re just trying to get across. It’s almost like a marketing. It’s a little bit more marketing than it is, like, discovery or learning or improvement. Like they’re like, Okay, I have my material, and now I need to, like, deliver it over and over and over again.

Steve Fouts  27:46  

I know exactly what you’re saying, and sometimes you appreciate it, yeah, because it’s well structured and well ordered and comprehensive, as opposed to someone spontaneously bloviating, where it’s hard to follow them. They’re authentic, but they’re also a little clumsy, So I go back and forth on that, yeah,

Katelyn Donnelly  28:11  

I know, yeah, it’s a performance, and you’re, you’ve, you know, it’s like you bought the ticket for the performance with the promise that it would be good and professional,

Steve Fouts  28:21  

Right? You know, here’s a question that’s kind of coming up for me, but I don’t even have it worked out yet. I’m going to make it up as I’m speaking. So I didn’t plan it. I’m going to just start talking about Avalanche Katelyn. I got to give you your props. Bravo on calling it something that’s evocative and that makes me want to understand what it is that that means to you and you know the people that you work with, and I’m trying to connect it to the quote, The future belongs to those who prepare for it today. You mentioned that Avalanche is something that is a framework for like a founder, to try to understand what’s going to happen in the future, kind of a sixth sense of what is going to happen. But evidence-based, if you look out in the world right now, it’s not immediately clear that this is actually going to happen, so it’s like an insight into something, and I don’t know if you could speak more about that. How you view that, what types of things you look for in someone who’s trying to, you know, give you their dream, and you want to know whether or not they’re predicting an avalanche that you want to be a part of. Anything you can say about that? I’d love to hear it.

Katelyn Donnelly  29:58  

Yeah. Well, well, the quote. Note on that is it’s sort of based off of is that historical changes like an Avalanche. The starting point is a snow-covered mountainside that looks solid. All change takes place under the surface and are rather invisible. But something is coming. What is impossible to say is when, and I think that there, and our view, my view, is that there are these massive societal trends that are sort of under the surface but are definitely coming. For example, we look at the birth rate in Western societies, and it’s going down. So the dependency ratio of like old people to young people is going up, there will be, like, more dependence on our working years population than there ever were in society before, because it used to be a pyramid. And so the implications of that are that you know, productivity of the labor force and education need to, need to have more primacy and take a bigger role in order for society to function the way that we have in the past, you know, 200 300 years, and so that’s like, kind of the macro perspective because people’s lifespans are also getting longer, right? So people are living longer, but maybe not working as long. And then you have things like government, like debt, which is increasing because we’re spending more than we are paying in and taxes. And many of these things are potentially are unsustainable and can have an it’s unpredictable what the tipping point is. But there are potentially like advantages, or there are technologies or like companies that can take advantage of this sort of future that we know is coming in a vague sense. We don’t know what the actual manifestation of it will be concretely, but we know that like these structures are definitely going to be real.

Steve Fouts  32:05  

It’s a blend of knowing the megatrends and then being able to translate it into something real that’s going to have to change because of the megatrend. That’s the insight. Yeah not easy to do, not on a lot of different levels, right, especially as a business where you have to deal with immediate pains totally you’re going to be successful. And if you’re a visionary, that’s great, but if you’re looking too far out in the future, you’re going to lose your stakeholders. You have to figure out a way to construct it and take advantage of that avalanche there. There’s lots of operational issues involved as well. So

Katelyn Donnelly  32:54  

It’s also really easy to be too early too and like, there’s like, an investor quote that being early is the same as being wrong. It’s like, you know, maybe you saw the avalanche coming and you know that this is happening, but if you’re, you know, three years too early, especially if you don’t have a way of, like, supporting yourself until some inflection point or like, big opportunity comes along, like, you know, and that’s one of the advantages of being a venture capitalist with a portfolio of companies is that you’re spreading the risk across, you know, 20 or 30 companies, and you don’t need, in fact, the built into the model is a very high failure rate. You just have to ensure that when one company succeeds, like when you have successes, that they can be so massive that they will make up for all the failure. I guess that’s kind of even part of the quote too, about preparing for the future, is that is like realizing when there are situations, and there are actually many of them that are like, you know, power law type situations, and, you know, diversifying your risk, or realizing that you’re going to need more at bat swings in order to be successful and not getting frustrated on striking out at the first one.

Dan Fouts  34:07  

Yeah, I love how that that all connects to your work. katelyn, that’s that’s really cool. I’m thinking also of of educational leaders and administrators and principals who, in their own way, have the challenge of trying to see ahead where things are going, but also deal with the day-to-day realities. And, you know, not in the venture capitalist context, but more in a leadership context of education, I think of students post-COVID. I think of social media. I think of the kinds of things that are interrupting and interfering with young people’s capacity to learn and accelerating their capacity to learn at the same time, the educational leader who’s able to see that and manage and lead in a way that is healthy is quite a challenge. I’ll leave it at that without there’s so much to say about that, but it’s.

Katelyn Donnelly   35:13  

Do you find that you know the pace of technology and societal changes is increasing so fast that it’s really hard as educators to keep up with, sort of the like, you know, like, I even think about, like, you know, people ask me for career advice all the time, and I’m like, I don’t, I don’t know. Like, I feel like the like, my career, the circumstances for which I came into it, were so different than, than the world today, that, you know, you can kind of give like principles, but not as like concrete, you know, pathway like people, I like, there’s in the like ed tech world, especially, you know, at the conference we were at in Minneapolis, there’s this desire for people to want these pathways for their career to be like, Oh, well, you know. And in teaching actually do kind of get that right, because you’re like, all right, I know I can teach at the school for for 30 years, and then maybe this will be like my retirement date. But there are very few things now on in our society that really have a clear pathway.

Dan Fouts  36:19  

Yes, I would totally agree we have career pathways. You’re actually using the exact language in our district in Illinois, and it is very hard to tell kids to prepare for one thing. They have to it’s more of a skill thing. I mean, and Steve and I are creatures of a liberal arts education, which I will promote to the day I die, is a really great way to think about education. Learn how to think, learn how to write, learn how to speak and communicate, and you can flow into a lot of different areas. Well, look, Steve and I are we’re in business. Yeah, we’re philosophy majors, and people forget that. And so I’m rambling a little bit, but I’m agreeing with what you’re saying in that it’s hard to predict a lot of these things, and we have to kind of prepare kids for a future that they can’t prepare for.

Katelyn Donnelly  37:19  

Yeah, I like to say, like, one of our investment themes is everyone is an entrepreneur, or they’ll have to learn to think like one. And I mean, you guys are teacher entrepreneurs, right? Because you’re both like you’re teaching, but you’re also entrepreneur. Have been building businesses, and like, thinking about opportunities, and every child kind of needs to do that as well, or everyone in our society. And yet, sometimes there’s, like, this rigidity of the existing systems. And there’s a lot of people that get so scared about ambiguity that they want certainty. They’re like, Oh, it’s just tell me what to do, or I need to, like, ensure that I have $100,000 a year job. Like, what job is going to guarantee me the ability to do that, and it’s like that. That’s like it’s just doesn’t work like that.

Steve Fouts  38:04  

I think you tapped into human nature there, wanting that certainty and the security. I really do believe that that may be something we can say in general, is what most people want, and that they’re okay with the the cost benefits, whereas there are some people who are going to be permanently restless and are going to need more, and they’re going to want to be more authors of their own life and existence, and I know that maybe flies in the face a little bit of your quote about everyone there’s an entrepreneur in them, I would actually agree with that, but maybe say that the level of commitment that you can expect from people to really pursue it in a real way, to change their life and change a career and leave a good job. That’s probably what’s different about it.

Katelyn Donnelly   39:09  

Yeah, that’s a good way putting it. I was as you were saying. I was thinking like, so I’ve been very entrepreneurial for my career, but my husband has had the same job for 17 years, and he just like, you know, keeps getting promoted, and, he’s good at his job, and he likes it. And sometimes I’m like, Oh, you could do this other thing. And he’s like, just not. He’s like, No, I just like doing my thing. And, but it’s nice. It’s also nice to, you know, have that partnership, like, because he’s like, that I get to it makes it a lot easier for me to, yes yeah

Steve Fouts  39:44  

 Combination,

Dan Fouts  39:46  

And a lot of it, of course, has to, has to do with your background, how you grew up, what kind of educational opportunities did you have, what kind of parental support structures, the whole equity angle to this, you know, some, People don’t have the circumstances that would give rise to taking risks and doing it’s not even on the radar because of how and how they grow up. And I mean, there’s so many factors here.

Steve Fouts  40:18  

This is starting to sound like a little bit about Sabri’s podcast, where we got into this stuff. katelyn, I don’t know if you know her story about coming from India, and it was fascinating, yeah, her entrepreneurial journey and the support she had or didn’t have, at different levels. Really, really interesting.

Katelyn Donnelly  40:38  

Yeah, yeah. I think she’s, her family is, like, owns mango farms, I think right in India. So they’re both entrepreneurial, you know, it’s like, but in a different context, yeah, okay, now she’s, she’s my neighbor in Austin, actually.

Steve Fouts  40:56  

Oh, wow, yeah, literally, neighbor, well,

Katelyn Donnelly  41:00  

Not like down the street neighbor, but I, I just now consider like everyone in Austin like a neighbor.

Steve Fouts  41:09  

I’ve heard great things about Austin. Our sister used to live there, so

Katelyn Donnelly   41:15  

Yeah, where I think it’s a big potential hub for the future of like ed tech entrepreneurs and like future of work thinking, and so there’s quite a few people in the ecosystem that are here.

Dan Fouts  42:04  

Well, we’re about an hour in. This has gone really quickly. Katelyn, I don’t know how you’ve perceived it, but

Katelyn Donnelly  41:39  

 Yes, definitely, 

Dan Fouts  41:40  

This has been fantastic. And it was really nice to hear, you know your story and experiences and how you really effortlessly integrated them into the quote, which is, the heart and soul of the teach different method. And I think we worked with the claim and the counterclaim. Well, there was a good, oxygen for both, and that’s that’s always important. And then we got into some really big issues at the end. Well, that’s the beauty of conversations. You can prepare for them. You don’t exactly know, I mean, related to the quote, you don’t exactly know what the future has in store. But if they leave us with things to think about. There is success, you know. And to that end,

Steve Fouts  42:26  

Here’s something to think about, if I can interrupt here’s a question, because we usually try to end with questions. katelyn, it’s claim, counterclaim, essential question. That’s the teach different method. Yeah. So the one I have is pretty straightforward. How do I know whether I should be preparing for the future or letting it happen on its own?  A bit general. I think getting ready to let it happen on its own is preparation, but I’m not really complicate this.

Dan Fouts  42:57  

A lot of ways to think about it. And again, we don’t have to necessarily answer them. They just give us fodder for thinking, well, Katelyn, thank you again. So much for being on the Teach Different podcast. We’re looking forward to publishing this and sharing it with the world and listeners hopefully will gain valuable insights from from you. Thank you so much,

Katelyn Donnelly  43:19  

Amazing. Thank you so much for having me.

Dan Fouts  43:21  

Thank you, Katelyn.

 

Transcribed by https://otter.ai